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Inside the Margins
Inside the Margins

Episode · 1 year ago

No Charges in Prude Case

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

No charges in the Daniel Prude Case, Attorney General James response to the decision and Bob Duffy's thoughts on incoming businesses to Rochester 

Inside the margins is sponsored by salvators. I just took a DNA test. Turns out I'm a hundred percent Rochester. That's right, I got seven Hundredzero matches. We are all COUGIE's. I can't wait to shake your hand. Oh wait, I can't, but I can feed you. salvators famous full and you touchless delivery. So those the coom marginalized groups can be the target of negative beliefs, behaviors or judgments from others. On this show we seek out marginalized voices and perspectives and tackle some of the conflicts and issues these groups face. Now is the time to have your voice heard. This is inside the margins with your host, Matt Wilson. Well, hello and welcome to another edition of inside the margins. I am your host, Matt Wilson, and we have gotten through February. We are now in the month of March, and March actually happy because it's the the month or spring begins and with everything that's been happening and everyone being cooped up in their houses, it'll be a good month to finally get outside and do more outdoor dory type things. So I'm very happy and looking forward to spring returning to us a lot of a lot of news. Of course, obviously there are things happening with the about Daniel Prue to the teacher James, and also just a ton of things to talk about and we're going to get into all some of our topics and a little bit. But first, before we get into our topics, let's go ahead in spring into action. What the dinority reporters? Patty singer, hello, Pattian, good afternoon. I hope you didn't spend all weekend do now. That one wasn't that great. I'm sorry, because it was an it was a nice weekend. Have done other thing. I mean. So I we talks about spring. Outdoes, I mean I've been outdoes all winter. You's been great, snowshoeing and things like that. So I'm not a bugs. Spring is a start of bugs and poison. I don't want you know, I'll be a real down around your spring. Matt you know what I'm gonna before you get to your the headlines, I'm going to say this. You're right. I've actually I've been outside cooking a lot more this winter because you're right. There's no bugs are in thing around my head when I'm cooking. So I'll give it. I'll give that one to you. You Win, okay, all right, thank you very much. All right, so and minority reporter. In the past week we published a black history month special and Karl Elizabeth Owens wrote a poem called cotton is not the fabric of our lives. In covid stories, the city gets a vaccine site to focus on underserved residents and education. Our CSD parent leaders rally and say the Rochester Teachers Association does not speak for them. Numerous stories about social and racial justice. You, Attorney General, announced no indictments in the death of Daniel prude. Monroe County hits reset on its response to the mental health crises. Rochester business leader calls for courage commitment to break silos and create systemic change. Local Coalition Demands Change Anti Racist Education and terminations. Spirit is Christie hosts my journey with racial justice speakers series. Monroe county named Diana Kimbro as chief diversity officer. The city's ten point plan to reform the Rochester Police Department covers recruitment policies, training and officer wellness. In other news, Adam bellows under fire for the Douglas Airport Renaming. Pamela re Smith writes your ancestry is black history. Mark morial writes the fight continues against racially motivated voter suppression, and Martha Hope has her senior moments column. Matt, thank you so much, Patti,...

...and as always, you can find the full versions of the headlines that petty just talked about on the minority reporter dotnet. All the full versions of those headlines are there. You also have the option to subscribe to the minerality reporter. Once you get there, you'll have the option of the hard copy or the digital version, your choice. I am a subscriber to the menoral reported script. witted get information that is important to you and about your community. So definitely check that out and also if you've missed actually what I go but let's go back to this. If you want to submit any suggestions, comments or questions to the minority reporter, you can certainly do that. All you have to do is send an email to editor at minority reporter Dotnet and they will check that out. And if you've missed any past episodes of inside the margins, you can go to inside the margins. RADIOCOM every single episode has found there. You'll also find us on iheartcom and wherever you get your podcast. All right, we're going to go ahead and talk about the Daniel prude case and the verdict, as well as what that speech from Letitia James Meant, as there're more to it than just speaking about what happened. We'll talk about that. This is inside the margins. Welcome back to inside the margins and I'm here with Patty. All right, so the case for Daniel prude was heard. They were wont to see if there's enough evidence to bring charges against the police to take that to trial, and it turns out the decision was that there weren't. There wasn't enough evidence to bring any charges towards to the police. Now we don't know exactly what those charges were. However, there seems to not be enough evidence and of course people in the city were not happy about that. There were some protests. They were not by comparison to the ones earlier when we first learned of Daniel proved by comparison they were much smaller, but still there was protest. I don't believe there were any arrests. I don't think there were any any property damaged or anyone was injured. But still, I do believe that protests will probably continue. I have seen it. There are planned. So people are upset about this, Patty. So let's talk about what actually happened and what what this means in regards to the police and Daniel proved. Well, there's a there's a lot going on here. There was the announcement that there was there were no indictments against the three officers who were seeing on the body camera footage. Map point out, we don't know what the charges are. So pay attention here because it's a there's a lot going on and we're going to be circling back on a few things. So in when she announced, when Tisha James announced there was not an indictment, she also said she wanted to have the grand jury minutes released. In grand jury is held in secret, so he don't know. Well right, yeah, that's just the way it has been. So she wants to have the minutes of the proceedings released. Apparently a judge is signed off on that. Apparently that surprised the attorneys for the police officers. They don't know what needs to be redacted. So that is going to be will be seeing that at at some point. So in that I'm what happens to grand jury proceedings once now that they can be open is a whole topic for another conversation. That's pretty kind of punching above my weight in that discussion. But what I'm interested in is what charges did she seek? You know, people talk about the police murder Daniel prud murder is a specific charge and it...

...there has to you have to meet a threshold for murder. Did she want to bring charges of murder against the police? Evident? We we don't know yet. Right. So, if she wanted to bring charges of murder, from what I've read, from what I've seen, I can understand at that point why there would be no indictment. Right, murders a very high there's a tie threshold. You don't trip over that bar. Yeah, yeah, for murder. Right. I am not a lawyer, I haven't covered law a lot, but I can throw the jargon around with the best of them. What what would be the standard of proof or to get an indictment on criminally neguige and homicide? What would be the level of evidence to get an indictmond on manslaughter? These are lesser charges. We don't know yet what what that is. So I'm I'm curious to know what did she did she try to hit a grand SLAM WITH NOBODY ON BASE? or or did she? I can you can tell. I used to be a basic sports you serve you well, yes, right. Or did she try to get you know, you go after a bunch of singles and doubles and keep the inning going and you get you know, you can get four runs that way. To you can get a bunch of runs just by singles and doubles and singles and doubles. I don't know. I'm curious to know if she swung for the fences or went for singles and doubles and that didn't work. I don't know. I'm curious. Yeah, me too. So I'M gonna I probably a little heat for this, but I'm going to bring this up because I have to. I want to make sure everyone has all the information that they need to make the proper choices or decisions on what they think or how they want to go forward. So, as far as I understand, and you've heard me talk about this case before and and the Daniel Prut thing, I don't believe what happened was good. I do believe changes need to be made and there's a lot that needs to be rethought and restructured as far as handling of things like this in the future. So I want to make sure that that's clear. However, I will say this too. It's really hard to charge police of a crime like that if they were following how they were supposed to do things, like they were trained in a particular way to handle an event in a certain way. So I guess what I'm saying is if they followed a book of how to handle this and they did that, even though how the hamlet may not have been what they should have done, and they were but they still were following the book and how they were trained, are they actually guilty? Well, so I would urge people to go to the New York state office offer the Attorney General. So the attorney generally released, at the same day as she made the announcement, a two hundred four page report. Don't be intimidated. Really, the first fifty pages, or what you need to read it, is that it's so. If you were to Google og report, prude New York Attorney General, you you'll come up with this. That Special Investigations and Prosecutions Unit Report on the investigation into the death of Daniel prude. So if you would have just enter that in a search engine, report on the investigation into the death of Daniel prude, you'll come up with this. So it is a there's a timeline of the sort of the intersection of all the most of the parties here. Of his brother talks about when how Daniel prude came to Rochester, what happened in seek to Waga, how his brother went to pick him up in in Buffalo and shelter and buffalo brought him back here, the interchange that's going on between the brothers, Daniels...

...actions, him leaving the House, the encounter that he has with the motorist who bakes that video, which has since been taken down. There to me was some fascinating things about that encounter that you you can read. There was a an expert who other media is reported he's he's he can be a bit an, you know, controversial in some of the things that he has found. He definding in this this report was, he says, the the officers should have turned Mr Prude on his side sooner than they did, but they again follow this is the training that they followed. You know, I've had people say to me, well then, what's the difference between that and what they did in the in the camps in Germany? People have said that. You know, I've sort of fumbled with an answer. I just I think that I think there is a difference in that. We're not going to get it. We're not going to get into that, into that here. But anyway, so the officers were criticized for their demeanor. Yes, I don't know that. I don't know that that being being perceived as insensitive. I don't know that that's indictable. It's certainly not good. But again, because they didn't treat him well. Is that? And there were comments that you could hear again. Is that? Is that? Can they? Can they indict them on that? Can they reprimand them on that? Certainly, right, right, certainly, yeah, here can do that. Right. So I would recommend that you read this report because it's it's it. It lays things out that you've read elsewhere. It's in one spot and it part of it does sort of a minute by minute of here's what's happening with with Daniel prude. Here's what's happening at the same time with this, with his brothers, you know, talking to the police. Here's what happens with the convergence. It's just very interesting to read about that, to read about excited delirium and what the expert says about that. Now, these are the experts that the attorney general brought in. If they have a track record of finding a certain way or interpreting evidence a certain way and you want to go a different direction, why do you bring them in again? These are things I don't I don't know, as I don't know how this works, but these are these are the questions that I have and I'm sure other people do. I'm not saying the attorney general, anybody, should stack the deck. No, absolutely not right. But she's a prosecutor, she's trying to she's trying to make a case. You're going to want the best expert witnesses to make your case right, to get this into a courtroom right, and then the defense will bring in their people and and I would want to sit on that jury that that that jury had. The grand jury had a tough job. Absolutely, yeah, jury would have had a tough job, but I'm not saying stack the deck, but you're going to bring in the people that you want to to have to make your case. They didn't make the case in the eyes of this grand jury. We will find out the details of this as time goes on. We don't know how long it's going to take. Yep, yeah, I guess, and I guess that information right. I guess. That's kind of what I'm saying. I'm not I'm not here. I'm not trying to judge at all. I'm not saying the cops were innocent or guilty. That's not I don't want to say that. I don't want to make a decision on that until we have more information. I'm just trying to make sure that we have we're everyone's thinking about what was put out on the table. And what I mean by that is, again, as you as...

...you alluded to you, I'm not saying what happened was the right thing. And obviously the human portion of you, even if you are following orders or whatever, or you're doing as your train if the human part you may see things are wrong and you may say to yourself, here, wait a minute, even though I know this is our training, the it's just this something about the seems wrong. Can't? We can't we handle this in another way? So, yeah, there's there's a human part of you versus the what, but the by the book view as well. So I'm not I'm just saying make sure you understand every single facet. It was much of it as you can't because you're never going to understand all of it, but as much of it as you can. Try to try to just try to consume all of that so you so you understand. Okay. So we're trying to see if a crime was committed. And how hard is it to prove that a crime was committed if the people who are hues of committed that commit in the crime are doing things according to New York state training and also our PD training, it's going to it's a very tough case. So I'm not saying don't be upset, I'm not saying the cops are right or wrong. I'm not saying either. I'm just saying just understand what the what the what the goal was here is to prove that these officers broke the law and the defense is they did everything that they according to how they were trained and if you, if you will, see what they did in it kind of coincides. It's a tough case. That's all I'm trying to say. Well, again, we don't know what the charges were, right, but we don't know what what she was trying to get them indict it. Sure. So there there are many, many times I have heard in the community nuity that the police murder Daniel proved. Murder is a specific charge and it's a you know, talk for it's beature. Pretty High. Yeah, high threshold. So the Medical Examiners report classified the manner of death as a homicide. I'm wondering if people use those terms anonymous. I think I'm certainly there and and then they're not. They're not straight synonyms. How am I gonna do this? I was bad at this in school. But a murder is homicide, but homicide may not be a murder. Yeah, that makes sense. Is that? Is that the way? I want it that way? I want to stay at thus the accurave seem I'll say that that's accurate. I'm murdering. A murder is always homicide, but a homicide is not always always umber. Right. So, so from the report, page nineteen, if you want to skip ahead, the in New York manner of death set forth in an autopsy is a medical determination made according to public health law, and it directs that medical examiners investigate deaths that occur without medical attendance and, if they are the result of external causes, deem them accidental, suicidal or homicidal. Okay, so this was so. I mean in a sense this was sort of an attended death. There were people there, but still the medical examiner came in and looked and looked at this. So homicide designation in an autopsy is not a legal culpability determination. The medical examiner in this case confirmed that her homicide and designation did not mean that a crime was or was not. Italics the attorney generals was it was not committed, but rather that Mr prude's death occurred at the hands of another. So the manner of death is homicide, was due to human involvement of the officers in restraining Mr proved. The legal determination of whether the medical homicide also constitutes a criminal homicide is a distinct determination. Now Mr Prud's cause of death was listed as complication of Asphyxia in the setting...

...of physical restraint, excited delirium and acute PCP intoxication I can't pronounce and classified it as a homicide. So we've got lots of lots of things going on here. And I thought of this the other day. There's a book on my shelf called when bad things happened to good people, and bad things happen to good people. Yeah, it's very true, and they're bad things that happen and and and what can we do about the bad things happen? If this was a bad thing, absolutely no, I don't think it is. Is How external again, this is a this is a bad thing. There were there were lots of people involved in this. There were, you know, Mr Poude had been in the hospital and he in here there and he left that. You know, there was somebody who, again, if you read this report, when he made the video, said, Oh, I didn't know, I didn't know them. He had died. I didn't know other things. Right. So there's lots of bad things happened here. M No, I agree, and the community in the family are looking for how can we, how can we make this bad thing less, less painful? Right, and that may come only when we prevent future ones. I don't know. It's let's do everything we can to make sure this doesn't happen again. But you know what, Matt, bad things happen. Yeah, it's two good people. It's tough. It's tough. I I think I said this when this first happened. We first talked about it on previous a previous episode. I always said this and I still believe this. I look at it, I look at everything, every single facet of this, and even at the hospital, like how quickly he was released. You know, there's one thing I always say. I always say this, no matter how good or bad police officers are, if police officers are called into a scene, police officers are going to act like police officers. So, if so, if a situation doesn't need the police stout handling, it should be handled by who should be handling it before the police get there. I don't know if that makes sense at all, Patty, but I don't something. There's a part of me that thinks that. I don't want. I'm not saying the hospital anything wrong. I'm not trying to blame anybody either, but I'm just saying it just seemed odd that someone who was in the state of mind that Daniel prude was in would have been so easily released from the hospital and to continue on that path. And that's why I say I look at every single facet, not just the encounter with the police officers. Could something else have been done before it got to the point where the police got there? That's well, you know, local, local ledged legislators have a legislators from this area who represent this area at the state want to pass something called Daniel's law, which will be which will address some of those some of those things about about mental health. I think we can only hope that that his life is memorialized in a way that helps other people. Very good that that a bad thing happened to him. And know how phrase this, but can it not happen to somebody else? Did you know? Some people will say everybody's put on Earth for a reason. I mean, was Mr Prved here to have Daniel's law? I mean it's then may be a horrible thing to say and it may not be coming out right, but but is there? Is there any way that we get that something good can come from this tragedy, that...

...other that we're now more aware of lots of factors of people's emotional state. Now some people may not want to hear this. They may think. You know, it's a day light more than a dollar short. There were two instances that I can remb recall within the last couple weeks where Rochester police were dispatched to a scene and called the forensic intervention team, which is the fit team, which is the cony team. Right. So people will say, well, they didn't do that for the for the nine year old at this was after the nine year old and I think that it is now and the mind of I'd like to say every rpd officer, but I don't go left far. I'd like to say it's in the mind of eighty percent now of the RPD officers. When they get to a scene, they're at least asking the question of somebody should we call fit now person in crisis team? You can ask. What about that? To My knowledge the pilot program has not been changed where they can go to a call and call the person and crisis team. So they would have to call the FIT team. FIT team is supposed to go seven there in the process of expanding that. If the FIT team covers the whole county and how? So, how many people are on it? Wants what's what's the estimated time of arrival. I mean there's all this stuff going on. People say, well, let's reallocate money from policing to do to have more forensic in avention team, to have more person in crisis team, but you have to have it set up so these individuals can respond quickly. Yes, agreed. Agree, and and my guess is that individuals responding to these types of situations may need some special training. I don't see US having seven fit tomorrow. I don't see US having I don't see us having enough people in the short term to handle their need for it. To be perfectly honest with you, yeah, I know, agree. So the law enforcement consul in Monroe County the one month or so ago announced they want all road patrol officers and every jurisdiction to have crisis intervention training. Every law enforcement agency signed on to that, from ourpd to you know, the the fair port right, you know he's ris it's charges of the smallest departments. That could take two years to train everybody in that. So I see a glimmer that our PD is saying when they when they arrived going, should we call the FIT team in? My thing would be if you ask the question, you should do it. Yep, if it's even crosses your mind, should we call fit do it now. It could take two minutes for them to get there. It could take thirty minutes when him to get there. Right. So police need the training in that in that meantime to stabilize that situation. That perfectly said. Right. Just keep that scene calm, keep it, keep it as calm as possible and keep it whoever is having the issue is contained and safely contained as possible and to the appropriate people. Arright, absolutely correct. Alluding to a point and got up. I'm not there again, I'm not translated. It sound callous either. But remember the amber alert. There's it's called an ember alert for a reason and fortunately something that the something happened is somebody before the amber alert was invented. So things do come sometimes improvements on how things are do happen once a tragedy occurs, and that is how the ember alert came to be. So Daniels Law maybe something on on that, on the lines of that as well. It's a tragic situation, Patty. It's hard. The community had a tough time with...

...it, not just because of his death but because of the way it was revealed. To us that he died. How long it took to get the facts out. The whole, the whole, nother. Yeah, that's a whole or another episode. That's what I'm saying. All that stuff combined just made this big ball of unrest in the city. So it's something that's not we're not going to get over any time soon. I think it's going to take a while before we get over that. All right, Patty, I want to take a break, but when I come, when I we come back. Le Tsi James had some comments and regards to the outcome of this situation here and I want to discuss that a little bit and see if, a m I looking too much into what she said. I'm I want to opinion and we'll find out. All right, well, be I hear with Patty Sayinger, this is Matt Wilson Right back. This is inside the mark. Inside the margins is sponsored by salvators. For More Information Don Foods offered and locations near you, visit Salvatorscom. Welcome back to inside the margins and real quick thank you to Salvatories for sponsoring our show. We definitely appreciate that keeping us on the air and also, as you heard, once you go ahead and go to Salvatoriscom so you can find the closest salvators near you and also the foods that they offer. All right, so, patty, everyone kind of heard, I believe not everyone, but the majority people probably heard or read about, with you, dish James and her response to the outcome of the Daniel prude case, and it seemed like a very, I don't know, very well rehearsed statement, almost political, and my my opinion, I just want to I just want to that's just how I felt when I heard it. We gets your opinion on that also. I felt it was a campaign spiedre we go. Well, because so like going back to high school civics, we have three branches of government, right, we have the executive, the legislative and the judicial, and we hear all the time, at least we heard from the former, you know, nationally, the former president hmm and, and a lot of presidents and will talk about activist judges and because the judiciary enforces the laws, they don't make the laws. So if somebody is out there listening and teaches civics and social studies. Let you know, make sure I get that right. So in her talk, in her comments about not getting an indictment, she issued a number of recommendations to the RPD to address concerns. So I were so some of the recommendations law enforcement officers, emergency communications providers, that dispatchers must be trained to recognize the symptoms of excited delirium respond to it as a medical emergency. All community he should assess models for responding to crisis situation that minimize or eliminate police responses to mental health call mental health calls. New York should mandate D escalation training for all police officers. The city of Rochester should adopt body one camera release policy regarding critical incidents. Law Enforcement Agency should explore the use of Spit soock alternatives. When I was in the room where she was talking about this, what I was hearing were legislative suggestions. MMM, that did judiciary doesn't get a vote on so she can say that New York should mandate d escalation training for all police officers. I don't think Anybo's going to disagree with that. HMM.

But is that the role of the judiciary to say that. So are these five planks and a platform? I don't know. Yeah, yeah, I that's the sense I got. That's same, same, it's fine, the same. That's the same feel. Like I got sheet. It seemed that she was kind of setting up policy ideas for someone who was going to be campaigning for a certain, I don't know, political nomination in the future. That's it. That's a it didn't sound like a stin reaction, and you know that. You get like you've watched. Everyone's watched cases before, I believe, and the prosecution did not get the outcome that they wanted and you know they'll remark their remarks. She was just kind of are strictly about the case, you know. But well, you know, we've present the best case we could. We're going to appeal it or bubble whatever, you know, whatever they say that to whatever. That's not that's not what I got here. That's not what we got. I think we got more of a it's my time on the podium type type reaction to that, to what happened, and that's just that the field that I got. Yeah, so I'm thinking what I mean. I'm not a political reporter. I just and I know even play one of these. Think you back to that all. I don't that old TV coactual right. People of a certain age are remembering that, even me. Yes, so, yeah, so, know what office is rope her which is it the purview of the Attorney General at this point? So as she and I don't even know what's proper protocol for the for the judiciary, how much it evens, is supposed to work with the legislative in the executive, because we have three branches of three branches of government, checks and balances. So I don't know if she's kind of, you know, putting a little bug in their ear about this is what you should be working on, or if she was saying, when I run for a different office, this is what I want to work on. I don't know. Now we don't really know and I'm not saying that that's the case. I obviously I'm like, I'm no psychic and I still can't read her mind. I'm not a mind reader either. I'm just saying the VIBE that I caught from that speech. You're right there. The intent there could be could just be like suggestions of Hey, you know, you know what, this is what we need to have happened, and so we're was listening. When we put the wheels Turk, get the wheels turning to make these things happen in the future or, like you said, when I'm in office. This is what this is what we can do, or we can look forward to these kind of changes that will be made. And I do again, I'm not I'm not trying to put any slider or any any any negative vibes towards the attorney general it. That's just how it felt. It just felt like that, that that was a campaign the very first campaign speech and in along forthcoming, I guess, in the future campaign speeches that to come, you know, soon. So I don't know, this is how I feel. That's just how I felt. Okay, and this is this is why you have a radio show, but say how you feel. That's right and I've certainly been wrong many times before. So could I could be moving on? I know we were talking earlier about a former mayor here, Bob Duffy, and he was talking and regards to some things that you want to talk about, I want to hear what you want to talk on. Regards to Mr Duffy, yeah, so I talked to him. I don't know a couple weeks ago because I was thinking here's he is the former police chief, yeah, he's former mayor, Yep, he is a former lieutenant governor, Yep, and he is now the head of the Chambers coronership right for the for...

...the region. So I wanted to talk to him about what is the persue? What's the perception the business community about what we've gone through in this in this city in the last six months, right or so? What is that? What is that showing to people who may want to come to Rochester and set up shop again? Remember, we've got legged, we still have Amazon, yeah, coming to the gates and the jobs for that and things like that. So what I had been after him for a while and when we finally connected after he had been part of a news conference that Congressman Joe Morelli had to talk about. Morelli has some legislation that he wants to get an innovation competition, nationwide innovation competition and Rochester Compete. And there's, you know, billions of doll is at stake here. So some of the people that Morelli had on the news conference had written this book. One of the one of the authors of the book said that Rochester ranks number one for its potential to develop high tech, high income jobs. All right, HMM. Well, Rochester also is number one an overall poverty, childhood poverty and extreme poverty compared to a dozen or so communities of its size. Which Rochester are we talking about? All right, so you know, I talked to to I talked to Duffy about this. So which Rochester were we talking about? And you know the fact that we have we have social unrest, we have racial unrest, we have a mayor under indictment. Yeah, so there's there's a there's a lot of stuff going on here that is not terribly positive to see it, and kindly right. So you know. So Duffy says that that Rochester. Often Rochester is seen as the hub for the Finger Lakes region. HMM. People Know Rochester. They may not know Victor Right, they may not know Genoese or they may not know Avon, they may not know gates, but they know Rochester. So, ratchet, but they also know Rochester as the place where Daniel prude died, where the mayor is under indictment and where there is it was a summer of unrest even before Daniel Pruve Right, George Floyd. So Duffy said that all that, in his was even and we weren't even getting to the pepper spray incident yet. Yeah, so, so the Duffy said that already one business is canceled plans and come to Rochester. He would not say who it was, but he said he believed he from recollections, it was before the pepper spray incident. He said that he he gets calls from business people who are asking his opinion about you take the temperature here. Should they should they come here and set up a business, or should they expand their business here? There's uncertainty in this community right now. Duffy says. Uncertainty is not good for business. Yeah, this is want to come where they can, where they can they can expand, they have a talented workforce that were ready pool of applicants, they can set up shop and they can they can do their thing. So when you talk about tech, there's a big divide here. Do you talk about tackle? The Rochester region is prepared to be an innovation hub? Like why is Rochester number one in potential to develop high tech high income jobs? Well, the data...

...that these authors use looked at, you know, graduate science programs, graduate undergraduate science programs, incube incubation, you know tech incubation patents. They looked at a commute time. You know the percentage of workers who have less than a thirty minute commute. They're looking at lots of things that to me as a city resident, really capturing the issues that we have in the city. We have we have a failing a lot of people will argue we have a failing school system in the city. How will we training these young people for these potentially tech jobs? What do we need from our it t and you, of are and the other institutions here to help raise up the education level in the city school district so to stay Rochester's number one? You give me tech, I'll give you poverty. We will meet in the middle somewhere. Right yet don't Wean the laugh? But that that's all. These are very good points and you're right. I think the tactics and which you're using to get the temperature of Rochester in order to bring businesses here don't tell the full story. I think you're absolutely correct. I think those are very robotic numbers that they're using to determine this as the the tech hub. There's a lot of there's a lot that's going on here and a lot of it is not good. And we've been in the news now nationally, recently twice for terrible things. Right. So a lot of people who may have looked at Rochester may see those things and may have changed their mind. Now, I do love roster. Always have love roster. Have to have the opportunity to leave the entire area, but I've come back because I like just something about being in this area. I like and I do think there's a lot of I do personally think this city has the potential to be, to be one of the best in the country. You know, there's all there's a lot going there's a lot that could be going on here, but this current climate, this current climate as a as it stands today, it's tough for any business to look at and say, yeah, everything's great here, let's let's jump right in and and get things going. There's a lot that there's a lot to be concerned about and you wonder does having some big businesses come here and commit to equity and hiring and opportunities help turn it around? I mean which this is the chicken and egg conundrum right. which is going to come first? A better climate that is more that businesses see, is more conducive and calmer for them, or businesses that want to come in and say we can help, we can help beat your solution by hiring, by having good wages, by having advancement, by people with, you know, for medical, in dental and K and all those perks that high paying jobs, the people that are associated with high paying jobs. One of the things that I talked to Duffy about, and this this is sort of a personal rankling for me, is I hear a lot about collaboration, hm in this community, but yet I don't always see it. People talk about it a lot, I don't always see it and I asked him to to address that and he did address it. I said this is the question that I asked him. You said there's division among government and leaders, yet leaders often say they collaborate in his response was, in part we have areas where it does work areas where it doesn't work. And he said, but I think our politics sometimes becomes toxic here, where so much effort is these battles and fights behind the scenes. I think we need less politics and more public service. Couldn't read that more. And that's from it. That's from somebody who was a politician,...

...right, still is to some extent right perhaps, and was a was in public service as a police officer and police chief. So this is him saying politics can be toxic. We need less politics and more more public services. And I go back to a saying I heard many, many years ago. I do not know the originator of this, I just know it was not me. I just heard it, saying that a lot can be happened when no one wants to take credit. Yep, yeah, I agree. And you know what, and I will say this and then we got to pretty much wrap it up, unfortunately, but I will say this. I do think employing people and pulling people out of poverty situations can definitely be something that can that can push polititics aside, because no matter if your demicat Democrat, Republican and depended or whatever you are, you're happier when you are employed and able to provide from your for your family. Then then if you're not right, so it doesn't really matter what side of the political spectrum you're on. So, to go back to your point, bringing in businesses that can actually help pull individuals and families out of poverty situations can certainly be a positive thing and actually put maybe change some of the unrest feelings that are happening in this city. Doesn't solve people who feel like they're still on not equity here. Doesn't solve people who think there's racism here, doesn't solve people who are our division in politics and all that stuff. That's not going to jobs aren't going to fix that. But being employed does still make you feel better than not being employed as so I do think till to that aspect. Having a business here at that helps get people jobs definitely couldn't hurt anything and they have to be again, I think, you know, they've got to be quality jobs, right dobs with advancement, jobs that are using jobs that are using people, all of people's skills, not just minimum wage dodge, not you minimum ways, not just taking advantage, you know, not just exploit of jobs, but jobs were people can can, at the end of the day, feel as though they they contributed, they decerned that, they learned and they came home and and we're able to show their their children and be inspiring to their children that yes, this is also something that you can do and you'd want to do well said Patty. Absolutely agre at that. All right, we got to wrap it up, but before we go, I just want to remind you the headlines that Patty talked about earlier. When we first start the show. You can get the full versions of all those headlines on the minority reporter at the minority reporter dotnet. Called to minority reporter Dotnet to get those full versions. You also will have the option to subscribe on that site, again, digital or hard copy. Great Way to keep yourself informed as to what's going on in the community and, as always, if you have any comments, questions or suggestions, are always happy to receive those. All you got to do this been an email to editor at minority reporter DOTNET. And if you're just tuning in right now, you missed it that, but that's all right. If you missed it, it's okay. You can go to inside the margins RADIOCOM and you can listen to this and all other past episodes of inside the margins in entirety. You can also go to you iheartcom or wherever you get your podcast. And before we go also I want to once again thank salvators for sponsoring our show. Always great to have someone who is behind us and keeping us on the air, and I ask, I keep promising. It will happen soon. Patty, we will have that slice. You have my word, Patty, we will have that slice. Can...

I have two if I get a walk, if I get a long walk beforehand. If I earn it, can have to. If you earn it, you can have to. Bring all right for patty singer. This is Matt Wilson. This is inside the margins and we will see you next week. Do you have a topic that you would like to discussed on inside the margins? We would love to hear from you. Please send your thoughts, comments or questions to inside margins at gmailcom. Inside the margins is sponsored by salvators. I just took a DNA test. Turns out I'm a hundred percent Rochester. That's right, I got seven Hundredzero matches. We are all COOGIE's. I can't wait to shook your hand. Oh wait, I can't, but I can feed you. salvators famous full and you touchless delivery. So thosecom.

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